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 Post subject: Banished and XP?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:02 am 
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Location: Georgia - USA
Mine won't run CC, but then again - how many of us dinosaurs are still around? Probably not enough for the modders to worry about. :rolleyes:

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 Post subject: Re: Weathered Buildings
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 9:57 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:49 pm
Posts: 3
Hawk wrote:
Mine won't run CC, but then again - how many of us dinosaurs are still around? Probably not enough for the modders to worry about. :rolleyes:


what kind of computer do you have Hawk?


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 Post subject: Re: Weathered Buildings
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 12:03 pm 
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Posts: 151
Location: Georgia - USA
Homemade. :big-grin: I built this thing about 10 years ago. The only upgrades I've done is replace the video cards, and a hard drive or two.

Motherboard - Gigabyte GA-M57SLI-S4
Processor - AMD Athlon 64 X2 4600+ AM2 - 2.4 GHz
Video Cards (2) - PNY GeForce GT 240 512 MB - Driver Version: 307.74
Hard Drives-Internal (2) - WD Raptor 150 GB SATA II 10,000 RPM, WD 500 GB SATA II 7200 RPM
Hard Drives-External (2) - WD 650 GB SATA II 7200 RPM, WD 160 GB SATA II 7200 RPM
Optical Drives (2) - LG HL-DT-ST DVD-RAM GH22NS30
Operating System - Windows XP Pro SP3 32-bit
Case - Antec P-180 ATX
Power Supply - Sparkle 650-W ATX FSP650-80GLC (80-GLCR)
Memory - (4) 1024 MB PC2-5300 DDR2-SDRAM Kingston - 667mhz
Case Fans (5) 120mm
Sound Card - HT Omega Striker 7.1
Speakers - Altec-Lansing 5:1 w/sub woofer
Monitors (3) - ASUS VW196 (19.1 Wide Screen), PAT LCD (17.1 LCD Square), HP w185e (18.5 LCD Wide Screen)

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 Post subject: Re: Weathered Buildings
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:30 pm 
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Hmmm... have you figured out yet what your tight spot may be? Looks to me as if you "pass" the minimum requirements -

******************************+
CPU: 2 GHz Dual Core processor
RAM: 512 MB
OS: Windows XP SP3 / Windows Vista / Windows 7 / Windows 8
Video Card: 512 MB DirectX 9.0c compatible card (shader model 2)
Sound Card: Yes
Free Disk Space: 250 MB
******************************

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 Post subject: Re: Weathered Buildings
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:54 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2016 2:44 pm
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Location: Georgia - USA
There's not a lot of difference between the minimum and recommend specs, according to the ShinningRock website.

Attachment:
Specs.jpg
Specs.jpg [ 19.62 KiB | Viewed 298 times ]

I have monitored the memory usage while playing Banished, using Speccy, and my guess is the 512 MB RAM listed is not quite accurate.
Here's a shot of my memory usage at idle.

Attachment:
Memory1.png
Memory1.png [ 4.87 KiB | Viewed 298 times ]

Here's a shot after the game is loaded with the game in pause.

Attachment:
Memory2.png
Memory2.png [ 4.75 KiB | Viewed 298 times ]


The biggest problem I can see is while loading the game. I don't have a screenshot of that but I did watch the memory usage and it spikes at about 80 to 99%, depending on what mods are installed.
I never did check memory usage with the default game but I'm sure it's quite a bit lower.

The best I can tell is the issue is the size and/or number of mods installed. The game uses a good bit of memory reading the pkm files in the WinData folder. Add to that the fact that even though I have 4 1-GB sticks of RAM installed, because I have 2 video cards my system - XP 32-bit - is only able to actually recognize 2.25 GB, I guess due to the way XP utilizes physical memory.
I do have my virtual memory set at about 6 GB min. and max, but it looks like Banished uses physical memory over virtual memory.

Bottom line: It looks like it's probably a combination of the way XP 32-bit uses memory and the amount of memory required to load the pkm files.
I'm guessing that if I removed one of the video cards, which would give me about 3.2 GB of utilizable physical memory, I could load more/larger mods.
One day, if I get really bored, I may try that and see what happens.

Maybe the default game would load and run OK with only 512 MB of RAM, but even XP needs 1 GB of RAM to run good. I don't know about Win 7 and above.
So I doubt the game would run good on a system with only 512 MB RAM.

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 Post subject: Re: Weathered Buildings
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:04 pm 
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Posts: 151
Location: Georgia - USA
It does look like Banished can utilize more than 1 core of the processor, so that's a good thing.
Here's a shot of processor usage at system idle.

Attachment:
CPU1.png
CPU1.png [ 804 Bytes | Viewed 296 times ]

And here's one while running banished, or it might have been while loading banished. I don't remember now. :laughing:

Attachment:
CPU2.png
CPU2.png [ 689 Bytes | Viewed 296 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: Banished and XP?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:36 pm 
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Location: Berlin
Have you tried to enable LAA flag on executables?

See here for more details -

http://wiki.tesnexus.com/index.php/2-4GB_game_memory_limits_and_solutions

:hmmm:

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 Post subject: Re: Banished and XP?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:55 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2016 2:44 pm
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Location: Georgia - USA
I'll look into that. Thanks! :big-grin:

Also, thanks for splitting this topic off from the other one and gave purringcat back her topic. :big-grin:

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 Post subject: Re: Banished and XP?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:28 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2016 2:44 pm
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Location: Georgia - USA
I read that article and then I added the 3 GB switch to my boot ini file. I also downloaded a utility that adds a LAA switch to the Banished exe.
Since I have added ChooChoo, NewMidievalTon and RKTrainingCamp mods and the 1.06 install didn't crash.
That's 52 mods at a total of 703 MB worth.

I couldn't do that before. :big-grin:

My 1.07 install has 26 mods at 582 MB. I did not add the LAA switch to the 1.07 exe.

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My Internet went down for an hour, so I had to talk to my family. They seem like nice people


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 Post subject: Re: Banished and XP?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:42 pm 
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Hawk wrote:
I couldn't do that before. :big-grin:

Hey, cool - glad it works... :jumper:

Don't spend it all in one place :roll-laugh:


* Sorry I didn't think of this earlier... it just came to me the other day that a few years back I needed that 4Gb Patch to make the NAM (Monolithic version) run with SC4...

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 Post subject: Re: Banished and XP?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2017 12:06 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2016 2:44 pm
Posts: 151
Location: Georgia - USA
Of course, now that I've found out you can have separate installs of Banished, as discussed over at WoB, starting with this post - http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?to ... 3#msg28463 , having a bunch of mods in one WinData folder may not be necessary as it looks like we can set up different installs. For instance; one for The North. One for NMT. One for DSSV, etc.

I'm still doing some testing on this as to how it will affect saved games, but I have found out that with the two Banished installs I have, all mods are in the one registry entry so a bit of diligence will be required when disabling mods in any one install.

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My Internet went down for an hour, so I had to talk to my family. They seem like nice people


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 Post subject: Re: Banished and XP?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2017 1:10 pm 
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Hawk wrote:
all mods are in the one registry entry so a bit of diligence will be required when disabling mods in any one install.

Yeah, that's too fiddly for me, and I don't trust the registry at all. Or my 'diligence'... :laughing-loud:

Being an avid collector, I have all mods (minus the ones I don't care for at all), and I made "bundles" or "suites" of them - first I scrub my registry, then I load one of my bundles (usually plus a few matching xtras that currently tickle my fancy)... so i.e.

- my North bundle includes most of Kid's stuff, most DS, some RK standalones...

- one has all RK plus some Kid and DS...

- another bundle has all Kid, all DS, Embx, assorted standalones...

- my CC bundle has a few selected standalones...

and so on (subcect to regular changes, right now I have 4 or 5 bundles, which will probably become more when that community chest takes shape). So every town I start has a different mix/match of mods, which kinda sets the mood (aside the start conditions)...

When new mods come out, they go to my "catch-all", then I decide what suite they might fit in and copy them there.


Now I rarely go back to a town I "finished" - however, I archive all my towns on a fat external:

* all (raw) images
* the complete suite of mods
* the autosave and the last full save

That way I can "resurrect" any town if wanted/needed - again, scrub the reg first, then load up that saved archive, good to go... :big-grin:

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 Post subject: Re: Banished and XP?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2017 2:05 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2016 2:44 pm
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Location: Georgia - USA
Paeng wrote:
Hawk wrote:
all mods are in the one registry entry so a bit of diligence will be required when disabling mods in any one install.

Yeah, that's too fiddly for me, and I don't trust the registry at all. Or my 'diligence'... :laughing-loud:


Actually, it doesn't seem to be as bad as I originally thought.

As you know, when you disable a mod in game, the registry entry for that mod will change from 'true' to 'false'. Then you would delete that entry plus the ModIndex entry.

With multiple installs of the game, if you have the same mod in another install, the registry entry will stay at 'true' if you disable a mod, so no need to delete that entry.
Once you disable a mod in the mod list in game, just delete that mod from the WinData folder for that particular game install and it will be removed from the mod list for that particular game install. As you mentioned in the post you made about Starting a New Game Without Crash:
Quote:
Code:
ModEnabled_*modname* --- (true | false)  // alphabetical listing
ModIndex_*modname* ---   (0 to xx)  // alphabetical too, probably an Index of LoadOrder

The ModIndex entry for that mod shows the load order for that mod in the mod game list in game.
The only issue I can see that might happen, and I'm still testing this, is that you may have to adjust that mods location in the mod list in the other game install to reset the ModIndex setting for that mod in the other install, if that mod should override another mod.
That said, with multiple installs, and being able to have specific mods per install, that shouldn't be too much of an issue.
So far I haven't experienced any crashes due to this issue.

The only real problem I've seen so far is the saved games folder. Multiple installs would require creating sub-folders in the saved games folder to reflect each install, as Banished will read all saved games in that folder, no matter which game install you created them from.
You would need to move the saved games from the main saved games folder into one of the designated sub-folders if you start a new game, and if you have saved games in that install you would have to move the saved games from the sub-folder into the main saved games folder.

I hope all that makes sense. :hmmm: :laughing-loud:

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 Post subject: Re: Banished and XP?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2017 2:25 pm 
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Hawk wrote:
I hope all that makes sense.

I'm sure it does... :roll-laugh:

You only lost me with your last sentence -

Quote:
You would need to move the saved games from the main saved games folder into one of the designated sub-folders if you start a new game, and if you have saved games in that install you would have to move the saved games from the sub-folder into the main saved games folder.

:laugh-cry:

But seriously - multiple installs under one reg... nah, I pass on that one :winking:

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 Post subject: Re: Banished and XP?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2017 3:02 pm 
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OK! Let me try this.

I have 3 installs of Banished. The default 1.06, a 1.07, and a 1.07 North.
In my saved games folder I have 3 sub-folders. Default, 1.07, and North.

When I play the default game and save a map, next time I load the default game that saved game is available. If I were to load a 1.07 game, that same saved game is still there, available to select.
The problem is: If you load that saved game, and have different mods in each install, you'll run into problems because the saved game is looking for mods installed in the default game.

Mod information is saved in 3 places. The WinData folder, registry, and saved game files. Banished looks at the registry to see what mods are listed. It then checks WinData folder to make sure that mod is there. Then it will update the saved game file.
If Banished finds a listing in the registry that is flagged as 'false', and it finds that mod still in the WinData folder, it sees this as an error, even if that mod wasn't used in the saved game. If that mod was used in the saved game, that presents a whole new issue.

When you add a mod, then enable it in the mod list in game, the registry isn't updated until you exit Banished.
I just verified that.
The same holds true if you disable a mod. The registry isn't updated until you exit Banished. Hence the need for exiting the game, as you mentioned in that topic.

With multiple installs, if you disable a mod, then exit Banished, it will still flag that mod in the registry as 'false'.
If you load a different install that has the same mod, you would need to re-enable that mod to change the registry flag.
This then would verify the data in the saved game. Hence the need for sub-folders for saved games.

From what I've seen so far, if a mod is in the registry and flagged as 'true', but Banished doesn't find that mod in the WinData folder, it doesn't seem to care. It only concerns itself if the mod is marked as 'false'.
I'm still working on verifying that 100% though, but that's my current take-away from what I've seen so far with the different installs.

All that said, it would seem that this idea doesn't really appeal to you, so I guess I'm just unnecessarily babbling. :roll-laugh:

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